Chicago's Duncan Keith assaults Nashville fan; where's the NHL suspension?
by Dirk Hoag on Apr 28, 2010 10:10 PM EDT
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PrintIn the late stages of Game Four last week in Nashville, Chicago Blackhawks defenseman Duncan Keith sat in the penalty box and had some back-and-forth with a Predators fan, retaliating at the end by spraying the fan with water before heading back out on the ice. The video has made the round in recent days, drawing a few chuckles from around the blogs. But as Greg Brady observes, why didn't the NHL suspend Keith for this incident?
The league suspended a HEAD COACH last season for engaging a fan with a water bottle, when all-around class dude John Tortorella lost his remaining marble on an obnoxious Capitals fan in Game 5 of the series...
For all the ridiculous stuff players get fined/suspended for in the NHL -- the bottom line is this is STILL a player assaulting a fan of one of the league's team.
Follow after the jump for a look at the video, and a comparison against the NHL's ruling last season relative to Tortorella....
First, the video of the incident from Thursday's Game Four:
And here's what the NHL said last April, when Rangers coach John Tortorella was suspended for Game 6 of the New York/Washington playoff series, after his altercation with a fan (with my emphasis):
"While it is a difficult decision to suspend a coach at this point in a Playoff Series, it has been made clear to all of our Players, Coaches and other bench personnel that the National Hockey League cannot-and will not - tolerate any physical contact with fans," said NHL Senior Executive Vice President and Director of Hockey Operations Colin Campbell. "We do not take this action lightly. It is the result of an entire day of investigation and evaluation that included the retrieval and review of videotape of the incident and discussions with Mr. Tortorella, other Rangers' bench personnel and a number of other people, including the security personnel at the Verizon Center.
"That investigation revealed that Mr. Tortorella squirted a fan with water before Mr. Tortorella was doused with a beverage.
"While, in these circumstances, it always is easy to allege mitigating circumstances, the fact is we do not tolerate contact with our fans in this manner. That is communicated before each season in a memo that is issued by the League to all of the management, coaches and players of every team. "The Sept. 8, 2008, memo entitled, ‘SUPPLEMENTARY DISCIPLINE REMINDERS FOR THE 2008-09 SEASON,' included the following section regarding Contact With Fans:
----------------
Even where a fan is verbally abusive, intoxicated, or profane, Club personnel should either ignore the conduct or, where appropriate, seek the assistance of police or security personnel at the arena.
This prohibition extends to all forms of physical contact, whether it be direct physical contact, the throwing of objects (including hockey sticks and other equipment), or even the squirting of water. While the latter form of conduct may have, in the past, seemed to be of a minor or harmless character, such conduct may serve only to incite and provoke an unruly fan and may ultimately lead to unforeseen consequences.
Accordingly, please be on notice that all Club personnel (management, coaches, trainers, and/or players) who engage in any form of physical contact with fans, including the squirting of water, will, on a going forward basis, be subject to discipline in the form of a suspension. The Club involved will also be subject to a fine.
----------------The suspension was issued pursuant to the Commissioner's authority under Section 6.3(j)(1)(a) of the NHL Constitution. Tortorella will miss the Rangers' next game - tomorrow afternoon vs. Washington.
Where, then, is Duncan Keith's suspension, Colin Campbell? This rule couldn't be any clearer. Duncan Keith should have been suspended for Game 5 of the Predators/Blackhawks series, but failing that, will he be suspended for Game 1 of Blackhawks/Canucks???
And just in case you think this a lot to make out of a little water-spraying, recall the Tie Domi incident from years ago in Philadelphia; while incredibly hilarious, it's not something the league wants to see repeated:
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meh..
I thought it was more funny than anything. I guess by the rule she should be suspended, but that’s a dumb rule. Torterella was fuming, Keith was just messing around. Had I been the guy I would think it was cool.
it seemed like
the fans who DID get squirted thought the same thing.
By letter of the law, the guy who brought this non-suspension up does have a point. However, Keith’s squirting vs Tortorella’s squirting (wow, neither of those sounded good) differ greatly. So I guess by the spirit of the law, not that it was specified, Keith’s incident wasn’t as big a deal as Tortorella’s.
But when it was suggested to him that Toews v. Kane seems likely to become a sidebar to every future international hockey tournament, he smiled and said: "I'd like us to win something together, too."
(Tweets @ChiBlackhawks and blogs at Blackhawks Down Low.)
by chiblackhawks on Apr 28, 2010 10:36 PM EDT up reply actions
uggh
The fact that the word assault appeared anywhere in a story about somebody getting squirted with a water bottle is just plain sad. Absolutely pitiful.
what if, and this is a big if
the water bottle was filled with acid? huh? huh???? That’s why these kind of rules are in place. Suspend him!
by Great Paperclip on Apr 28, 2010 10:21 PM EDT up reply actions
Purely by legal definition though, a simple assault is a criminal assault that is not accompanied by any aggravating factors. And just because it seems ridiculous, but the Tie Domi vs. fan incident started with a water bottle squirt. This rule is in place to help prevent altercations from going farther. If it’s a rule, it’s there for a reason and should be enforced. Whether anything of seriousness took place, Keith crossed that invisible line between athlete and fan.
Excellent point
I’ll add the Domi video above… classic example.
More fun than a stick to the face!
On the Forecheck is SB Nation's blog covering the Nashville Predators.
BS
the hawks got away with it through the entire series. this is just example 1,952.
And of course the Chicago faithful will step up with the smallest of insignificant details to make it seem as though the Chicago player did absolutely nothing compared to a largely similar event.
it’s all just BS.
What did the Hawks get away with?
Were there 1,951 other squirting incidents that I missed? Please elaborate.
by HungryHungryPanda on Apr 28, 2010 11:43 PM EDT up reply actions
alot
…of mostly little things. like holding the stick, post whistle cheap shots, players catching and holding the puck, Marian Ho$$a, etc.
(and 1952 = sarcastic exaggeration.)
Hawk fan here
but even I will admit the officiating was crappy this series. There were a lot of non-calls on both sides, but I could see how Preds fans would feel slighted for stuff like the Sopel hit on Erat after the Game 5 Hossa goal.
I was at Game 6 and brought a notebook with me to take notes on the game (you know an obsessive hockey fan when…). The officiating was bad enough that I started to keep a running tally of missed calls. Slashing, cheap shots, hand passes — there was a lot that went unremarked, on both sides.
by spokeinthebandwagon on Apr 29, 2010 12:19 AM EDT up reply actions
thanks
it actually makes me feel better that an opposing fan agrees on the horrid officiating. we seem to run into this every time we enter the playoffs. so it actually makes me feel better to know that we can agree on that.
I'll give you that Hossa could have been suspended
and there were a number of plays that went the Hawks way such as the Hammer puck throwing incident, and a lot of people on our site talked about Dave Bolland getting away with a high stick (I didn’t see it). But to claim that only the Hawks were the beneficiaries of missed calls would be a mistake. Toews got tackled from behind right in front of the net in Game 6 with no call, and the most clear example came when the Hawks had possession of the puck in the offensive zone with a 2 on 1 and the play was whistled dead for no reason other than to call a penalty on the Preds. There were blown calls that hurt each team.
im not saying it was biased
im saying it was ridiculous and i am tired of seeing officiating like that in the post season.
No, you were clearly saying it was biased
the hawks got away with it through the entire series. this is just example 1,952.
I think we all get caught up in blind homerism – that’s why we cheer for a specific team and not both sides, so there’s really nothing wrong with it IMO, but it will get you called out on a blog site. I also understand that three borderline “situations” were the result of actions by the Hawks (Hossa, Sopel, Keith). I’d probably be a bit pissed too whether or not an objective observer thought it was warranted.
No one wants to hear an objective opinion after your team loses – and mine clearly isn’t, but IMO, none of these calls/non-calls affected the outcome of the series. We’ll never know, but calls go both ways though and I was pissed about a few myself.
Well, folks, I want to thank you for being here for the recording of my live comedy album. Funny material and laughter will be dubbed in later.
by ChicagoNativeSon on Apr 29, 2010 5:57 PM EDT up reply actions
One could argue that Hossa not being ejected affected the series, but there was no real way for the ref to tell if Hamhuis had injured his head. The non-ejection was the safe call.
On the Forecheck/Twitter/CLS
"What do you think this is? Major League Baseball?"- Shea Weber
by Chris Burton on Apr 29, 2010 5:58 PM EDT up reply actions
I think my head would have popped if he got suspended
after what we saw in terms of relative “justice” during the reg season.
Well, folks, I want to thank you for being here for the recording of my live comedy album. Funny material and laughter will be dubbed in later.
by ChicagoNativeSon on Apr 29, 2010 6:14 PM EDT up reply actions
ok
so say the preds got away with 1952 as well. it would even out in number, but still wouldn’t make it right. i am just tired of always being pissed about horrid officiating in the playoffs. i think there needs to be a change to the system. as it is now the refs have to much power on the outcome of any given game, and that is the opposite of the way things should be.
oh
and the is the preds blog. i should be allowed to be as homeristic and biased as i please. if i went to SCH i wouldn’t be commenting like that. nor would i call out hawks fans for doing the same.
CNS is a good SBNer, and allowed for the homerism:
that’s why we cheer for a specific team and not both sides, so there’s really nothing wrong with it IMO
On the Forecheck/Twitter/CLS
"What do you think this is? Major League Baseball?"- Shea Weber
by Chris Burton on Apr 29, 2010 6:05 PM EDT up reply actions
No worries.
On the Forecheck/Twitter/CLS
"What do you think this is? Major League Baseball?"- Shea Weber
by Chris Burton on Apr 29, 2010 6:08 PM EDT up reply actions
Thanks Chris
Yeah, I think I spent half of my comment defending homerism! I find it hilarious that opposing team’s fans come over to another team’s site and get all work up that people are actually cheering for their own team. God forbid!
Regarding your other reply. I personally think the officials “let them play” more in hockey than other major sports like basketball or football. I gave up years ago on basketball for exactly this reason. What I’m not sure I like about the NHL is how officials seem to balance out the penalties. On one hand you can say “Well, at least then no team get a huge advantage”, but on the other hand, what if one team is completely dominating the other team? Why should they be penalized just for the sake of evening things out?
Well, folks, I want to thank you for being here for the recording of my live comedy album. Funny material and laughter will be dubbed in later.
by ChicagoNativeSon on Apr 29, 2010 6:12 PM EDT up reply actions
"Regarding your other reply"
was referring to flyalder
Well, folks, I want to thank you for being here for the recording of my live comedy album. Funny material and laughter will be dubbed in later.
by ChicagoNativeSon on Apr 29, 2010 6:13 PM EDT up reply actions
coaches challenge
it is the one thing i have always loved about the reffing in football. it isn’t much but i believe it goes a long way with keeping the refs honest. i would love to see a system like that in the nhl. the refs seem to be more aware when they know if they aren’t they can be subject to humiliation on any given call. it also just makes sense because of the speed of the game. the refs can’t see everything and missing one call away from a play can change the course of the game.
a little randomness but you’re football comment just made me think of it.
I'd have no problem with something like that. Good idea.
The biggest problem I have with NHL officiating is the lack of a disciplinarian system for them as stern as in other sports.
Well, folks, I want to thank you for being here for the recording of my live comedy album. Funny material and laughter will be dubbed in later.
by ChicagoNativeSon on Apr 29, 2010 6:26 PM EDT up reply actions
that too
i would love to hear the NHL disciplining the refs for obvious one-sidedness. like our Philly game earlier this year. even their blog was admitting that the reffing was one-sided, but of course nothing came of it for the refs.
(p.s. i am not drawing any connections between that game and this series)
Don't they have a ref representtive at each game?
Does nothing happen to the ref if they see a “blatant” bad call? I guess I just assumed something happened after the game. Is there a ref review?
I went to a fight the other night and a hockey game broke out.
- Rodney Dangerfield
i've heard of something like that
where after the game the refs review tape of missed/bad and good calls of the game. but i don’t think anything disciplinary happens to the refs.
feel slighted?? how about abused!! combine the incident with Hossa with the Sopel hit – definitely could have injured either of the pred players. Plain and simple DANGEROUS HITS!!!
by EXPECTATIONS on Apr 29, 2010 12:46 AM EDT up reply actions
Assaulted?
If this is assault, then the three stars of the game assault the fans each game by throwing t-shirts at them.
Players are allowed to be playful. Keith is freaking smiling the whole time…the guy is being kind of douchey, but Keith is clearly just playing with him. I mean, he sprayed the glass.
Section303.com
Don’t get hung up on the use of the word “assault” – it’s irrelevant.
The NHL has a clear rule that specifically says that squirting fans with water leads to a suspension. The Preds got screwed again on this one, but at least I’d like to see delayed justice. Keith shouldn’t play in Game 1 against Vancouver.
More fun than a stick to the face!
On the Forecheck is SB Nation's blog covering the Nashville Predators.
it would be nice to see them pay for something
"Looks like Ellis used a pork chop to comb his hair after his haircut" (Tweet from Jordin Tootoo) Go Preds! (and Bruins)
by hockeydekefreak on Apr 29, 2010 11:50 AM EDT up reply actions
It just seems
A little tin-foily…he squirted the glass…while there’s a seam there, there’s no evidence the fan actually got sprayed…
It’s no different than when they bang pucks off the glass in warmups when they see a fan not paying attention.
Section303.com
I hear you, it’s no big deal, but, “the rules are the rules”, do you think they should start throwing out rules willy-nilly? oh wait…they already have
"Looks like Ellis used a pork chop to comb his hair after his haircut" (Tweet from Jordin Tootoo) Go Preds! (and Bruins)
by hockeydekefreak on Apr 29, 2010 12:06 PM EDT up reply actions
In that case, we should also discuss how we weren’t penalized and we haven’t been fined yet for the ice crew twirling the catfish.
Section303.com
that’s cool, as long as it goes both ways.
"Looks like Ellis used a pork chop to comb his hair after his haircut" (Tweet from Jordin Tootoo) Go Preds! (and Bruins)
by hockeydekefreak on Apr 29, 2010 12:37 PM EDT up reply actions
side note..
I’ve met the guy that twirled the catfish. We drank some beers, played some shuffle board, hung out with the Nashville roller girls, and talked Preds hockey. I wasn’t surprised at all to see him twirling that catfish….I loved it!
"Looks like Ellis used a pork chop to comb his hair after his haircut" (Tweet from Jordin Tootoo) Go Preds! (and Bruins)
by hockeydekefreak on Apr 29, 2010 12:40 PM EDT up reply actions
I was all for it. I even yelled “TWIRL IT”…because you could kinda tell he was going to.
Section303.com
How could you not?!!
"Looks like Ellis used a pork chop to comb his hair after his haircut" (Tweet from Jordin Tootoo) Go Preds! (and Bruins)
by hockeydekefreak on Apr 29, 2010 12:50 PM EDT up reply actions
Haha, that's hilarious
"Looks like Ellis used a pork chop to comb his hair after his haircut" (Tweet from Jordin Tootoo) Go Preds! (and Bruins)
by hockeydekefreak on Apr 29, 2010 3:54 PM EDT up reply actions
I thought the catfish was one of the funniest parts of the game.
When the ice crew member came out there and twirled it triumphantly, I laughed my head off. I mean, I’m a Hawks fan and even I thought that was great. I’d be disappointed if the League legislated out that sort of thing.
by spokeinthebandwagon on Apr 29, 2010 6:40 PM EDT up reply actions
I think it's an honor for the guy that got sprayed.
You think the fan is complaining?
Graphic Designer/Researcher/Writer at Music City Miracles.
Official Graphic Goon of On The Forecheck.
by Aditya T (smashville) on Apr 29, 2010 10:03 AM EDT reply actions
Not sure its an "honor",
but all this was is good banter. Assault seems a bit overstated. Hell, ’Hawks fans were more douchy than this. Go Canucks!
by southernfriedhockey on Apr 29, 2010 10:18 AM EDT up reply actions
to me, this story is more of a traffic generator than anything
nothing to see here.
+1
Really guys?
"...can i have a glass of whiskey and a slice of bread?"
by west_fulton on Apr 29, 2010 11:15 AM EDT up reply actions
I don’t understand this sentiment. Duncan Keith, like Marian Hossa, broke the damn rule. Its not a discussion over whether or not the rule should be there, its whether or not he broke the rule. He did. And according to it, there are consequences. The NHL’s discipline system is a joke.
On the Forecheck/Twitter/CLS
"What do you think this is? Major League Baseball?"- Shea Weber
by Chris Burton on Apr 29, 2010 11:21 AM EDT up reply actions
It's a joke, alright..
this is the kind of stuff that chips away at a fan’s faith in the league.
"Looks like Ellis used a pork chop to comb his hair after his haircut" (Tweet from Jordin Tootoo) Go Preds! (and Bruins)
by hockeydekefreak on Apr 29, 2010 11:45 AM EDT up reply actions
There aren't a lot of black and white rules in hockey - it is a shades of grey game
even when the rules look like they are black and white, they generally aren’t.
It’s just that way. Always has been.
Confusion will be my epitaph.
I never want to be the one to play the conspiracy card...
…but is anyone else getting the idea that the Powers-That-Be took firm hold of the steering wheel to make sure this car gets to the league’s intended destination? First the brushing off of the Kopecky hit on Klein, the Hossa hit on Hammer and now the selective enforcement of the rules in the Keith incident. Also, how did the ref miss the Sopel cheap shot on Erat when he appeared to be looking right at it? Ordinarily I would have said the Keith thing was no big deal, but with the pattern that seems to be emerging, it’s beginning to feel like it may end up being a very big deal indeed.
by TitanPredBearFan on Apr 29, 2010 11:40 AM EDT reply actions
I’m the farthest thing from a conspiracy theorist, but I gotta say this stuff has really had me wondering.
"Looks like Ellis used a pork chop to comb his hair after his haircut" (Tweet from Jordin Tootoo) Go Preds! (and Bruins)
by hockeydekefreak on Apr 29, 2010 11:43 AM EDT up reply actions
I could agree with that running though your minds
I highly doubt it is true, but I could envision myself in the same boat if the tables were turned.
That being said, I don’t feel the league or refs made the wrong call on any of these plays – and I definitely don’t feel that any of them were dirty except for Sopel’s. Unfortunately the video I saw was from far away. Does anyone have a better link to his push in the back after the game? Strange thing is, that is really (and I mean really) out of character for him. But hell, I saw it too.
Well, folks, I want to thank you for being here for the recording of my live comedy album. Funny material and laughter will be dubbed in later.
by ChicagoNativeSon on Apr 29, 2010 6:22 PM EDT up reply actions
Sopel is the one that gets me...
Hossa…. fine, don’t like it, but fine. shades of grey, no big deal
Keith…. “a rules a rule”, I agree he should be held to the rule, but this really isn’t that big of a deal
Sopel….. now I’m angry!!! That was an extreeeeeeeamly low class move, and he will forever be hated by me (and I’m sure other Preds fans) for it, and he deserves every bit of it. If I was a Hawks fan(eeeek), I’d find it really hard to cheer for him right now.
"Looks like Ellis used a pork chop to comb his hair after his haircut" (Tweet from Jordin Tootoo) Go Preds! (and Bruins)
by hockeydekefreak on Apr 29, 2010 6:50 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I found the Sopel - Erat situation somewhat humorous
(now hear me out before everyone freaks) in a “life kicks go when you’re down” sort of way. I’m not condoning what Sopel did. But after Erat completely f’d up, made slow-as-shit Sopel look like Ken Yaremchuk, and probably felt as low as he ever has in his career, along comes Sopel from behind and knocks him on his face. Erat had to be thinking, “Oh, just FU hockey gods!”
I think we’ve all kind of been there before. I felt pretty bad for him since no one deserves that fate (well actually, there are a select few I can think of). On the bright side for Erat, the only way is up!
Well, folks, I want to thank you for being here for the recording of my live comedy album. Funny material and laughter will be dubbed in later.
by ChicagoNativeSon on Apr 29, 2010 9:10 PM EDT up reply actions
I'm sensing your sarcasm
Well, folks, I want to thank you for being here for the recording of my live comedy album. Funny material and laughter will be dubbed in later.
by ChicagoNativeSon on Apr 29, 2010 10:15 PM EDT up reply actions
Also in Game 4, Niemi in period 2 clearly played the puck in the no-goalie zone while McCreary was right there watching. He made the save and the puck scooted away from him. He reached out with his stick and pulled it back toward his glove, but when he handled the puck it was clearly in the ‘pizza slice’. Others also made this observation, but the whistle was for a covered puck, not a penalty on the goaltender.
Sopel, Keith, Hossa....
I don’t see squirting Gatorade as a horrible offense, but “the rules are the rules”….. oh wait….no they’re not….especially for the Preds.
"Looks like Ellis used a pork chop to comb his hair after his haircut" (Tweet from Jordin Tootoo) Go Preds! (and Bruins)
by hockeydekefreak on Apr 29, 2010 11:41 AM EDT reply actions
this is pretty much
NSH fans still being salty about losing
i think its pretty apparent from the video Duncs is bantering back and forth with the fan and playfully squirted water at the glass…if you want to break it down to the letter of the law and say squirting a fan with water is assault – then ill break it down by the laws of physics in that he didnt squirt a fan – only glass…thus no offense taking place
haha, yeah. I'm a fan and I agree.
I’m tired of losing in the first round too, but hey it’ll happen. We’re going to have a young team next year, and it’ll get that boost of energy I see lacking a lot of the time.
I’ve never been one to follow the rules to the letter myself, so I will just say these things are blown out of proportion. I’m iffy about the Hossa “push”, but this squirting the glass was definitely no big deal. If it was acid (then Keith would be pretty hardcore, since he drank from both bottles there) and got through the crack in the glass, then the fan could sue the player/team/league. I don’t need to cry over spilled milk – or squirted glass.
haha
then ill break it down by the laws of physics
yup
by Great Paperclip on Apr 29, 2010 9:13 PM EDT up reply actions
No, but you should read the rest of the thread. The point is to bring into question the NHL’s application of their own rules.
On the Forecheck/Twitter/CLS
"What do you think this is? Major League Baseball?"- Shea Weber
by Chris Burton on Apr 29, 2010 4:06 PM EDT up reply actions
So….you’re using it as a jumping off point to bitch about reffing?
Join me on the Hockey Blog Adventure! (or Twitter.) GO BRUINS! (and Wild!)
by Cornelius Hardenbergh on Apr 29, 2010 4:16 PM EDT up reply actions
Not about reffing, but the league’s ability to enforce their own rules. Its pathetic. I fully agree that what Keith did was harmless and funny, but according to the letter of the law, discipline should be handed out. I don’t ‘think’ he should be disciplined, but the rulebook does.
On the Forecheck/Twitter/CLS
"What do you think this is? Major League Baseball?"- Shea Weber
by Chris Burton on Apr 29, 2010 4:25 PM EDT up reply actions
There are a lot of rules unenforced and you pick a fun and silly video to be the one to single out?
Join me on the Hockey Blog Adventure! (or Twitter.) GO BRUINS! (and Wild!)
by Cornelius Hardenbergh on Apr 29, 2010 4:26 PM EDT up reply actions
Because we are a Predators blog and it involves the Predators, yes. We did the same thing with the Hossa hit.
On the Forecheck/Twitter/CLS
"What do you think this is? Major League Baseball?"- Shea Weber
by Chris Burton on Apr 29, 2010 5:08 PM EDT up reply actions
Is this news?
Everyone with a decent knowledge about the league knows the wheel of justice is a joke. This is not breaking news.
OK, you’re bitter about the lack of a Hossa suspension. Fine, I get it. But the two incidents are not related. Get over it. This entire post reeks of immaturity.
aaaaaaaand comprehension fail.
On the Forecheck/Twitter/CLS
"What do you think this is? Major League Baseball?"- Shea Weber
by Chris Burton on Apr 29, 2010 10:42 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I started reading with the intent of posting something like, “Oh, come on! It’s just a little water squirted at an annoying fan.” But after reading the NHL statement, you simply can’t say that. There is absolutely ZERO wiggle room in that rule as stated. Maybe the NHL SHOULD have written the rule more subjectively, but they DIDN’T.
And since this happened it Game 4, it IS a big deal. Games 5 & 6 were extremely close, and Keith’s presence could have affected the outcome of the series.
The excuse I can think of would be if the NHL genuinely didn’t know about the incident. After all, the offical in the box didn’t see it. I know it was posted on youtube, but I don’t think the NHL is responsible for searching youtube for evidence of misconduct. Is there any documentation that proves the NHL was aware of the incident?
"Get to the Choppa!"
there is ALWAYS wiggle room in NHL discipline (often an absurd amount of it)
Confusion will be my epitaph.
Honestly, this is a joke. How do you have a blog? You’re team lost, to a better team, stop looking like a jacka$$ and a child, bitter because you lost days ago coming up with garbage like this to put the blame on. Give it a rest.
This is a Preds related issue.
This is a Preds blog, so it’s mentioned.
Graphic Designer/Researcher/Writer at Music City Miracles.
Official Graphic Goon of On The Forecheck.
by Aditya T (smashville) on Apr 29, 2010 4:54 PM EDT up reply actions
how do you not realize that this is just a re post of a Toronto blogger’s story, and its here because of its relevance to the preds. I challenge you to backup your comment and find in the story where he blamed the series loss on this. (btw leave the comment thread out of it since you are attacking Mr. Hoag’s original story.)
Awwww...
Somebody needs a nap and a juicebox.
We’re having a perfectly calm, rational discussion about a pretty blatant double standard in the enforcement of the NHL’s rules as stated. Nobody is saying that Chicago was/is not the better team. Obviously they are; they won.
You’re the one throwing a hissy-fit because you’re worried that the NHL will try to compensate for their oversight by suspending Keith now. Don’t worry, it won’t happen. Keith will be there for Chicago’s inevitable destruction of Vancouver.
Next time you decide to join a rational conversation, try checking your emotions at the door. That way you won’t embarrass yourself with a pathetic temper-tantrum. PS-I think it’s adorable how you replace S with $.
"Get to the Choppa!"
like Ho$$a?
;)
Well, folks, I want to thank you for being here for the recording of my live comedy album. Funny material and laughter will be dubbed in later.
by ChicagoNativeSon on Apr 29, 2010 6:28 PM EDT up reply actions
Smells like a troll, looks like a troll…
On the Forecheck/Twitter/CLS
"What do you think this is? Major League Baseball?"- Shea Weber
by Chris Burton on Apr 29, 2010 5:09 PM EDT up reply actions
Shut up, dude, seriously? They have a legit gripe. I disagree that Keith should be punished, but I can see how Nashville fans would think the rules had been unevenly applied (because it’s true). Stop embarrassing Hawks fans.
by spokeinthebandwagon on Apr 29, 2010 6:47 PM EDT up reply actions
Take a non-biased look
You don’t think that hawl fans would object to the incidents with Klein, Hamhuis, and Erat- happened the other way around? You better believe that there would have been HE!! to pay – you guys got away without penalty, other further penalty in each of the above cases. In Erat’s case – the play was over and I cannot understand, with an official there, how something – anything was not called. This is just outrageous. Look at all the teams in round two – Looks a little quirky!
Technicality
Duncan Keith squirted a fan with Gatorade not water. It’s still physical contact under this rule, but if you’re going to be a sore loser and demand that he be suspended for what appeared to be a humorous exchange, with the so called “victim” being recorded laughing after having been “assaulted”, then you need to stop watching hockey and start baking cakes, you woman.
Not really following the sore loser moniker. We didn’t lose because some fan got squirted with Gatorade. All we’re asking is why the NHL isn’t consistent with its clear as day rules.
If Shea Weber squirted Gatorade all over someone at a United Center game, would you be interested in this rule? I think so.
On the Forecheck/Twitter/CLS
"What do you think this is? Major League Baseball?"- Shea Weber
by Chris Burton on Apr 29, 2010 5:12 PM EDT up reply actions
This is almost as ridiculous as the Red Wings blogger having the balls to declare our national anthem tradition unpatriotic and disrespectful.
We’re talking about a game where some of the most elite athletes in the world sprint around on an ice rink on blades carrying large sticks, sporadically checking each other into the boards and on open ice, often resulting in brain trauma and permanent injuries. The mere notion that a layer should even be disciplined, let alone suspended and fined, isn’t just insulting, it’s pathetic. This is professional hockey, not bowling or chess.
This post isn’t a personal attack on Chicago. It’s a bullshit whining session about one of the little technicalities that have been woven into the sport over the past 25 years. Before we know it skaters will be wearing cages and checking will be a penalty. Again, this is hockey. Grow a set and stop whining about some asshole that got a little bit of lemon lime Gatorade on his face, when everyone who saw that video knows he had it coming to him. Wait, here come the cries of injustice that this poor fan was “assaulted”, thus making him a victim. Give me a fucking break.
If Shea Webber squirted a Hawks fan at the U.C. for being an asshole and disrespecting an athlete while he was doing his job, I would respect him even more. If a stranger came into my office at work and started asking me about my salary and telling me I sucked I’d probably do more than shoot them in the face with Gatorade.
Tone it down, bub
1. Watch the video
2. Read Colin Campbell’s statement
How can you possibly say Keith shouldn’t be suspended? Keith should sit out Game 1 vs. Vancouver, end of story. It should have been Game 5 vs. Nashville, but that’s water under the bridge.
If that helps knock the Blackhawks out, would that make me happy? Sure, but that doesn’t change the facts.
More fun than a stick to the face!
On the Forecheck is SB Nation's blog covering the Nashville Predators.
Very witty
I see you have a firm grasp of the facts at hand, and have come up with a reasoned, nuanced response in your team’s defense.
More fun than a stick to the face!
On the Forecheck is SB Nation's blog covering the Nashville Predators.
The very problem with this whole issue is that you expect me to defend my team, which implies I agree that what Keith did was wrong, and in turn disagree with the leagues decision by default. The exact opposite is true. What Keith did is not assault. It’s Gatorade to the face. Period. I disagree with this rule on every level. The leagues inaction indicates that they too don’t consider it an iron clad rule, which is fine by me.
True, if Kane was taken out by one of your players the league would respond accordingly. But they would do so because of player safety, and because it would have obviously happened as part of the game, on the ice. The fact that you folks are calling for a Keith suspension because of some nonsense that took place in the penalty box with a fan that clearly deserved to get shot in the face with a few ounces of Gatorade is, to me, pathetic.
The very problem with this whole issue is that you expect me to defend my team, which implies I agree that what Keith did was wrong, and in turn disagree with the leagues decision by default. The exact opposite is true. What Keith did is not assault. It’s Gatorade to the face. Period. I disagree with this rule on every level. The leagues inaction indicates that they too don’t consider it an iron clad rule, which is fine by me.
Fine. So do I, as a matter of fact. That, again, is not whats in question. Keith should be disciplined because the rule is in place and because if one player gets away with messing with fans then who knows what could happen down the road because they know that they won’t get in trouble.
On the Forecheck/Twitter/CLS
"What do you think this is? Major League Baseball?"- Shea Weber
by Chris Burton on Apr 29, 2010 5:45 PM EDT up reply actions
If you need Keith to serve a one game suspension to satisfy the little girl in you, I suppose that’s fine.
If you’re going to participate on the site, I’d appreciate that we not resort to name calling in order to enforce our points.
You’re ignoring the crux of my argument, so its difficult for me to respond to the above.
On the Forecheck/Twitter/CLS
"What do you think this is? Major League Baseball?"- Shea Weber
by Chris Burton on Apr 29, 2010 5:52 PM EDT up reply actions
The problem here MD
is that you have a valid opinion. We all have opinions, but we try to discuss them civilly with respect to the other commenters and without the name calling. You’re here on an opposing team’s site expecting them to have a non-partisan view – it ain’t gonna happen. So if you can’t handle their contrarian view, I would suggest you post on a like-minded site and not make an ass out of yourself. I personally might support some of what you’re saying if you weren’t so abrasive in your presentation.
Well, folks, I want to thank you for being here for the recording of my live comedy album. Funny material and laughter will be dubbed in later.
by ChicagoNativeSon on Apr 29, 2010 6:03 PM EDT up reply actions
why don't you?
you are here whining and complaining like a woman on her time of the month (no offense to actual females)
Nice comeback.
Think of it this way: a rule is a rule is a rule. If Jordin Tootoo knocked crap out of Patrick Kane via the head, and broke a rule, the entire NHL would be screaming for justice. Because thats the rule. Whether the rule makes sense or not, they ought to be enforced. Do you drive twenty over the limit because ‘speed limits are silly’?
On the Forecheck/Twitter/CLS
"What do you think this is? Major League Baseball?"- Shea Weber
by Chris Burton on Apr 29, 2010 5:36 PM EDT up reply actions
Because thats the rule.
I think they’d actually be angry because Tootoo broke Kane’s head.
Join me on the Hockey Blog Adventure! (or Twitter.) GO BRUINS! (and Wild!)
by Cornelius Hardenbergh on Apr 29, 2010 5:37 PM EDT up reply actions
Yeah, but you get the point. Rule broken = discipline.
On the Forecheck/Twitter/CLS
"What do you think this is? Major League Baseball?"- Shea Weber
by Chris Burton on Apr 29, 2010 5:39 PM EDT up reply actions
I don’t know, I sure was happy when Chara didn’t have to sit after he responded to a slash with dropping the gloves near the end of a game about a week ago.
There’s jackboot “discipline” where these are the rules and they must be followed at all costs and then there’s justice, which is I think a better thing to go for. And in that case, the whole thing was pretty playful.
Join me on the Hockey Blog Adventure! (or Twitter.) GO BRUINS! (and Wild!)
by Cornelius Hardenbergh on Apr 29, 2010 5:44 PM EDT up reply actions
Right, but the Chara thing was slightly different, if I remember correctly. Didn’t the replay clearly show Gaustad slash him, negating the instigator?
Point taken in your second point. I think the rule’s lame.
On the Forecheck/Twitter/CLS
"What do you think this is? Major League Baseball?"- Shea Weber
by Chris Burton on Apr 29, 2010 5:46 PM EDT up reply actions
So if the rule’s lame why are you championing it?
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by Cornelius Hardenbergh on Apr 29, 2010 5:47 PM EDT up reply actions
Because its a rule. And to be perfectly honest if Weber or whoever had squirted a fan, then I couldn’t complain about any discipline.
On the Forecheck/Twitter/CLS
"What do you think this is? Major League Baseball?"- Shea Weber
by Chris Burton on Apr 29, 2010 5:49 PM EDT up reply actions
I would have if it happened and I were a preds fan. It seems so small and petty.
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by Cornelius Hardenbergh on Apr 29, 2010 7:25 PM EDT up reply actions
Eh. Its over.
On the Forecheck/Twitter/CLS
"What do you think this is? Major League Baseball?"- Shea Weber
by Chris Burton on Apr 29, 2010 7:29 PM EDT up reply actions
It was over before this whole post went up.
Next time include the video from tortorella squirting instead of the domi one.
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by Cornelius Hardenbergh on Apr 29, 2010 7:35 PM EDT up reply actions
I didn’t post it.
On the Forecheck/Twitter/CLS
"What do you think this is? Major League Baseball?"- Shea Weber
by Chris Burton on Apr 29, 2010 7:38 PM EDT up reply actions
I already linked to the Tortorella video above
More fun than a stick to the face!
On the Forecheck is SB Nation's blog covering the Nashville Predators.
if Weber did that in Chicago...
with a Hawks fan saying the same things this douche was through the glass I believe surrounding fans would be telling him to sit down and shut up.
“how much do you make a game”…“im going to pull the fire alarm at the hotel”… you guys are cool with this guy being the face of Predators nation right now? I feel sorry. I wouldnt like that much either.
"...can i have a glass of whiskey and a slice of bread?"
nobody is championing it
we are asking for fair and unbiased enforcement of the rules as they are written.
EXHIBIT 8 PROCEDURES RELATING TO COMMISSIONER DISCIPLINE
Timing of Suspensions
Whenever possible, suspensions will take effect beginning with the game immediatelyfollowing the game in which the incident giving rise to the suspension occurred.
As a general matter, a Player who is suspended shall serve a specific number of games.
nobody demanded anything.
and thank you for agreeing that it is a violation of the rule. “It’s still physical contact under this rule”-you
Why are you Chicago fans acting like this post is a personal attack?
It’s not like the NHL is going to declare a do-over. Nobody here has suggested that Chicago didn’t earn their victory. We’re simply pointing out that there is a problem with the way the NHL has written and/or enforced this rule.
Are you not capable of joining a logical discussion without getting your feelings hurt?
"Get to the Choppa!"
just once
i would like to read a Colin Cambell press release where he just says “its in the rule book like this…. So the player is suspended”
If that happened
the NHL fanbase’s heads would collectively explode. He can’t function without his wheel of justice.
I went to a fight the other night and a hockey game broke out.
- Rodney Dangerfield
possibly
but players would be held responsible for their actions that broke rules, like when human beings break the law.
that might actually be nice if it were ever to come to pass
and if the league ever got serious about better expressing the rules as they actually intend to enforce them
but that is something for the GM’s annual meeting and to commence in October, not something to start mid-stream in the playoffs
Confusion will be my epitaph.
I totally agree the rules need to be enforced
I just don’t see a huge crackdown coming in the near future
I went to a fight the other night and a hockey game broke out.
- Rodney Dangerfield
Have you ever gotten out of a speeding ticket? Or gone past a radar gun at 1 mph over and not gotten pulled over?
Join me on the Hockey Blog Adventure! (or Twitter.) GO BRUINS! (and Wild!)
by Cornelius Hardenbergh on Apr 29, 2010 5:37 PM EDT up reply actions
im a pilot
and a young starting one. i don’t speed becasue possible employers look at driving records.
or more realistically (for me) been clocked at 108 and only been written up for 90?
so it wasn’t a big deal thing, just a simple (large) fine?
Confusion will be my epitaph.
Yeah, sure, exactly like that.
Join me on the Hockey Blog Adventure! (or Twitter.) GO BRUINS! (and Wild!)
by Cornelius Hardenbergh on Apr 29, 2010 5:44 PM EDT up reply actions
Patten raised this above...
Is there a video that shows that the fan actually got sprayed with Gatorade? It looked like he was standing behind a large pane of plexiglass. I’d be in agreement that Keith should be suspended if he shot the gatorade over the glass at the fan, but spraying it at the glass is harmless I think…unless there is a large seam there that Keith tried to shoot it through and it went through, I’m not bothered.
Support Coyotes Hockey - Five For Howling
(Oh, and go Philly teams as well!)
The fan is yelling and then listening through a slot between panes. Then he gets squirted through it.
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by Cornelius Hardenbergh on Apr 29, 2010 7:24 PM EDT up reply actions
Wow, this post blew up in an hour.
It’s a rule. Rules should be followed. Those that don’t follow the rules should be punished, no matter how stupid the rule seems. End of story.
Graphic Designer/Researcher/Writer at Music City Miracles.
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by Aditya T (smashville) on Apr 29, 2010 6:54 PM EDT reply actions
I think the real problem is that this is a bad rule. Because it wasn’t enforced, our blog has a legitimate reason to be upset. But if it had been enforced, there would have been an equally legitimate outcry on how ridiculous a one game suspension was.
To me, this points to it being a bad rule, probably instituted as an overreaction to the Domi incident. Blame the league!!
Really disappointed...
Really disappointed in you guys when I read this, I expected better…
Even a blogger should have more journalistic integrity then you showed here. When I read that Duncan Keith had squirted a fan with a water bottle I was wondering if I had missed something. Instead I find out that Duncan Keith had squirted at a wall of glass in front of a fan. Big difference and if you think the league would suspend a player for doing that for a playoff game you are entirely nuts. Seriously guys he at most would get a talking too.
As for all of the whining about missed calls and what not… Memory is an interesting thing. You only remember selective events. You don’t remember everything that happens. As an example, you will remember missed penalties that should have been called for your team. You won’t remember the ones that should have been called against.
You won’t remember the crosscheck when a player hit Toews in the back. That was a 5 minute major and automatic game misconduct that wasn’t called there.
You won’t remember the highstick that drew blood on Kopecky which should have given the Hawks a 4 minute advantage.
I could go on and on. The point in all of this is that this serious did NOT turn on a missed penalty call. And complaining about penalties after it is over is whining. And I had much higher expectations of you guys than that…
Really disappointed…
I agree that this is no big deal, but.....
Instead I find out that Duncan Keith had squirted at a wall of glass in front of a fan.
you might want to have a second look at that video. There is a good size gap in the glass, the fan (i.e. idiot) got sprayed directly in the face. You can’t do that the rule is very clear on this (did you bother to read it or any of the comments?). I agree the headline might be a little mis-leading, but this is a very valid point that Dirk has made. If this happened in CHI, you can bet they would throwing a huge-ass fit, a bigger one than we have. A rules a rule, dude.
"Looks like Ellis used a pork chop to comb his hair after his haircut" (Tweet from Jordin Tootoo) Go Preds! (and Bruins)
by hockeydekefreak on Apr 30, 2010 12:06 PM EDT up reply actions
Your disappoint is a joke
No, the spray hit the spectator not just the glass. And as has been said a dozen times already, A RULE IS A RULE. If the NHL isn’t going to bother enforcing the rule then why have it in there to begin with! So what that this incident is ‘different’ from that of the Tortellina…er, I mean Tortorella incident. According to the written rules on the subject, what happens before and after the actual squirting of water isn’t the deciding factor. It’s the squirting of water itself that is prohibited.
Did the fan actually get wet?
There is a nice thick piece of glass between the two. Looking at the video it appears to just hit the glass not the fan. A little messy but no more of an assault then the green men in Vancouver.
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